Think about all the Realist painters after Impressionism took over. No matter how amazing your work was, you couldn't sell it because people only wanted to buy a Van Gogh. Same thing in today's world. You could make an amazing powerful thought-provoking insightful film, but people will still only flock to so The 300.

How would you guys name the different film "movements" that are present today? I dont really think its "independent" vs "hollywood".


P.S. As a firm supporter of Kyle Johnson, flaming towards him will not be tolerated (?)

This message has been edited. Last edited by: braininabox,

Here's how I look at it. Inspiration and revolution comes by accident. No one who says "I'm going to change film!" ever will.

There are always bad movies. It only SEEMS like current cinema sucks (I don't agree with this anyway, but some claim it) because we're watching it as it plays out -- the bad along with the good -- instead of remembering only the good.

It seems that so many critics simply don't like movies. Ok that sounds retarded but how can anyone possibly say there are no good movies out there right now. Sure it's not a huge movement but they do exist. Plus history helped give context as the French New Wave is far mor a romantic ideal now than it was at the time. Plus digging the FNW is just a phase all filmmakers will go through, like potheads liking the Doors. At a certain point Breathless becomes nausiating, but then again who dosn't love a good jumpcut.

But before this turns into a teenage angst thing by Kubrick groupies let's get back to the point of NL's original post. That we as filmmakers should really put more of ourselves into the content of our work. This generation has made a major leap in terms of access to technology and now it's time to stop f*cking around and make some worthwhile statements.

And again NL's statement was for filmmakers going forward, not critics in training. So if you havn't even made a film yet you may want to stop reading this go outside and create something. This is studentfilms.com after all.

(Oddly enough that's sort of how the French New Wave got rolling, a filmmaker got sick of François Truffaut constantly taking a shiz on his movies and told Truffaut that if he was so smart why dosn't he go make a movie. Truffaut said f*ck it and made a little film called The 400 Blows one of the greatest dramas ever. Yes I went trhough a FNW phaze and the Doors as well)

This message has been edited. Last edited by: REDking,

Josh why dont u make a movie about your mom

OHHH SNAP


No but I wasn't criticizing today's cinema, just all the student films I've been seeing. After reading an article interviewing the guy who did that "Myspace the movie" thing, I got worried. He's in our age range (21 I believe), and got notoriety for making a terrible and unfunny short movie about kids on myspace. Of course kids obsessed with myspace ate it up, he got popular, interviews with magazines, and probably some horrible deal with MTV. In the interview he talked about how people like him were the next generation in film, that our generation wanted things fast paced and cool, and that theaters were basically going to become obsolete. Then he spent the rest of the interview talking about how awesome he was.

Maybe he's right. After seeing only films about people shooting each other set to hardcore rap and rock music on myspace, I got depressed and worried. It's just all starting to seem superficial, and it seems like too many people behind the camera are the same people who buy a guitar to get laid.

And I think it's people like us who need to make something that really stands out or is more powerful to overcome stuff like this. That's all I'm saying. The stuff doesn't need to be ANGRY per se, I'm just talking about passion.


PS> And yeah, the french new wave is sort of like the doors for filmmakers. Except I never stopped liking the doors or the new wave...and at a time like this their ideals seem ironically refreshing.

quote:

PS> And yeah, the french new wave is sort of like the doors for filmmakers. Except I never stopped liking the doors or the new wave...and at a time like this their ideals seem ironically refreshing.

I agree! I guess I forgot you have to go back to basics and revisit the stuff that originally got you inspired.

I couldn’t explain why but when I read this it reminded me of what Larry wrote in his initial post.

This is an excerpt from a book by Christopher Noxon:

Once upon a time, boys and girls grew up and set aside childish things. Or so the story goes. Nowadays, moms and dads skateboard and download pop-song ringtones. Captains of industry pose for the cover of Business Week holding Super Soakers. The average age of video game players is twenty-nine and rising. Disney World is the world’s top adult vacation destination (that’s adults without kids).
It’s hard to imagine adults in previous eras so unashamedly indulging their inner children. But these are not the adults of twenty years ago. They constitute a new breed of adult, identified by a commitment to remain playful, energetic and fun in the face of adult responsibilities. Whether buying cars marketed to consumers half their age, dressing in baby-doll fashions or bonding over games like Twister or stick ball, this new band of grownups refuses to give up childish things they never stopped loving, or else revels in things they were denied or never got around to as children. Most have busy lives and adult responsibilities. Many have children of their own. They are not stunted adolescents. They are something new: rejuveniles

I agree with someone above. This is incessant whining!

Get over this self-indulgent slump and let's go out and make movies! Do what you like. If you like Hollywood monotony, great! There's a place for that! If you like heartfelt indie, so be it!

Life's too short to be moping about whether we're making a movement or a statement or whatever. It can't be forced. Do what makes you happy, and to hell with everyone else.

I didnt read any of these posts cause frankly this board has really dug itself into a pit, not in regard to what you people say, but the lack of actual A/V to your belts. Im not one to talk anymore either. I think everything that can be said has been said. the point is to get off your ass and do some filming. When i said I find good footage allowing unexpected things to happen, I mean straying away from traditional ways of filmmaking. Anyone can write a script about Bob and Nancy going on a killing spree and you can get every little shot down adsactly as u saw it on the paper, but you didnt give any room to allow anything to happen. this is why so many movies are alike these days. Everyone is just copying everyone elses methods of filmmaking. I think the only way anything can work is if there's enough holes in your "story" to allow unexpected filler to seep in. You gotta experiment around at every step

wow very um interesting

where da movies at, pig?

Kyle... this is strange, but I actually agree with you there.

Filling Bolster makes my mind happy.

This is a very interesting discussion.

I'll say this about putting "heart" into film - yes, passion reflects in a film. If it comes from anger, depression, love, whatever the case, it can always make for a great film.

I will also say this, though - there are many great films that have absolutely nothing to say. Monty Python and the Holy Grail is a film that will be talked about for probably centuries to come, but it has no message, no deep, passionate feelings about society. Film doesn't need those things to succeed.

I also do not believe you have to put life experience into a film. A lot of people do not need to relate to films to enjoy it. Some people would be uncomfortable watching films that are too close to reality, and some people find it arrogant and insulting to think that celluloid could ever be a containment cell for human emotions.

One thing that really struck me, though:

quote:

If you like Hollywood monotony, great! There's a place for that! If you like heartfelt indie, so be it!

I think the two are not mutually exclusive. The flaw is that we see almost everything Hollywood makes, but mainly just the cream of the crop when it comes to Indie films. And if you want to discuss monotony, how many indie films are about teens going on road trips discussing existential nonsense and pop culture arguments? And how many indie films are about shy, average-looking, disillusioned guys finally finding meaning in life? Indie films are just as monotonous as Hollywood films can be; its just indie films picked a subject that doesn't get old as quickly.

That ends my pessimism.

I will say to Nervous Larry that you needn't worry. Every generation of fine art, literature, film, etcetera, always worries that things are going downhill. However, every generation turns out its own timeless piece of work. Take the 90's for example - a time full of mediocre films that nobody will remember in 10 years time, save say... Forest Gump.

There is always hope, but as you said, it is upon us to be proactive in it. I do worry about our generation as well, but people mature and mellow in time.

We'll have to put up with an avalanche of crap, but if that crap wasn't there, good films would be so less inspiring.

quote:

Originally posted by Uxbridge:
Take the 90's for example - a time full of mediocre films that nobody will remember in 10 years time, save say... Forest Gump.

Seriously? I thought the 90s produced a lot of good films. Fargo, Shawshank Redemption, Schindler's List, Reservoir Dogs, Pulp Fiction, Goodfellas, The Big Lebowski, The Usual Suspects, The Professional, Unforgiven.

People in this thread love making dumb blanket statements without taking 2 seconds to think about what they're saying.

quote:

Monty Python and the Holy Grail is a film that will be talked about for probably centuries to come, but it has no message, no deep, passionate feelings about society.

Maybe its just me, but I thought Monty Python/Holy
Grail was quite satirical and had a lot to say about society.

Are you guys worried about what impact the tech singularity will have on film? Or creativity in general? That scares the pants off me.

technology is a problem in a sense that it creates a distraction for talented filmmakers putting too much time and effort into one off hacky shorts instead of trying to make a step up to features. But overall the tools don't define the craftsman, in other words just because they make a mini casio keyboard dosn't mean everyone can now play piano. Availability will simply make the modern filmmaker better practiced by the time he or she actually comes of age. (thoughts I stole from stephen reedy!)

as for tech singularity I never underestimte our vindictive and manipulative nature so if a computer becomes "superintelligent" it will still be suseptible to our collective selfishness and brute force not to mention and EMP strike or a looney toons style magnet!

And to anyone questioning the validity of modern film just watch Children of Men and eat some crow with your slurpee.

I don't think technology, by itself, is either good or bad. A lot of the look of New Wave films, for instance, was due to new technology -- faster film speeds made the New Wave possible.

I agree with both sides of the argument here. There are a lot of extremely good contemporary directors, including American directors.

But I think it's also true that in general American audiences have a really restrictive understanding of what narrative films should be like, and Hollywood motives and formulas dominate American filmmaking. Not bad, necessarily, but limiting.

quote:

Originally posted by DrMagnificent:

quote:

Originally posted by Uxbridge:
Take the 90's for example - a time full of mediocre films that nobody will remember in 10 years time, save say... Forest Gump.

Seriously? I thought the 90s produced a lot of good films. Fargo, Shawshank Redemption, Schindler's List, Reservoir Dogs, Pulp Fiction, Goodfellas, The Big Lebowski, The Usual Suspects, The Professional, Unforgiven.

People in this thread love making dumb blanket statements without taking 2 seconds to think about what they're saying.

I agree. the 80's would be a better example. Save maybe Raging Bull, and a few others, the mid-late 80's were utter trash.