I got this review from my movie today"

"Wow, not only did you steal copyrighted music, you had the nerve to name Harry Gregson-Williams in the credits? Shameless creative theft...

- Evan Kubota"

What am i doing wrong? I didn't steal the music or anything, It would be stealing if you sold the movie to someone obviously. Also, why can't I give Harry Gregson-Williams credit for the soundtrack. I gave him CREDIT! So that is really not stealing the music. One other thing! I hate pirated stuff, so I bought that Soundtrack! It's not stealing!

lol, jesus. thats pretty scathing.

the way i see it, i try to make every project able to be bought at any given time. i own everything in my movie, that way, I can sell it or do whatever I want with it without worrying about the possibility of a lawsuit or royalties. In theory, you shouldn't even post it here if you don't have permission to use it, but that aside, you should be inventive enough to use your own music or something in the public domain.

i'm not saying one thing or another about your movie, as I haven't watched it, but keep in mind next time laws about intellectual property.

yea, but technically it's illegal to even use the music unless HGW or whoever owns the rights to the music signed off on your project. Some people dont like hearing "mainstream music" in studentfilms at all, and prefer to only hear original stuff. Personally I don't mind the copywritten music, unless its incredibly noticeable (theres a thread about this right now), but i prefer original songs. It gives the whole film a more professional quality and is totally legal (if you ever made money off your film)

It is still stealing the music!!!!!!!!

Being the son of a full writer member of APRA(australian performing rights association, who are responsible for composers rights and royalties within australia. to become a full writer member at least one song by the composer must have charted) and a current director of an independant music label, i know a fair bit about this.

To include a song in a soundtrack as a part of a production that is to be publicly screened, in any medium(including the internet), for profit or not is illegal without first gaining the specific clearances from the writers themselves (or their publisher), and the recording company that represents the recording artists, and holds the copyright on the recording itself. The clearances must cover the teritorys of screening and what mediums the film is to be displayed in.

Do you walk into a store and just take a loaf of bread because your giving it to charity, and its non profit???? NO, the same counts for ALL copyright law.

Though in saying that, it is very rare for any of these guys to realy care. But if one does your up sh*t creek without a paddle, and they WILL crush you. Normally they will warn you first but.

Using any kind of copyrighted material is illegal without permission. There's a myth that it's legal if you're doing it for educational purposes or if you're not selling it. You're still using someone else's work.

As far as the policy on this site goes, we hold the filmmaker responsible for the content they submit. We encourage submitters to get permission but we know they probably won't. I have one film on this site that uses music by Yanni, which took me months to get permission for, because I refused to use any other piece for my film. But if I'm making a film that will be exhibited, I usually either make my own music, find someone to make music for me, or I use royalty-free tunes. Not only is it legal, but it's more satisfying.

It's not that record companies don't care, far from it. It's just that they don't always notice. People have gotten into trouble for this kind of thing before. I would advise to go about it cautiously if one decides to do it.

And, since it's illegal, I do not condone it.

"What am i doing wrong? I didn't steal the music or anything, It would be stealing if you sold the movie to someone obviously. Also, why can't I give Harry Gregson-Williams credit for the soundtrack. I gave him CREDIT! So that is really not stealing the music. One other thing! I hate pirated stuff, so I bought that Soundtrack! It's not stealing!"

You didn't obtain permission to use the copyrighted music in your film. Not only did you use it without permission, but you even named the composer, as if you not only had permission, but had the score created specifically for your film.

How can you be against piracy but in favor of using copyrighted music without permission? Do you even understand the basic problem with appropriating whatever music you want in your movie without permission?

Why do stores etc. sell soundtracks then? It makes no sense to just sell it if people aren't going to use it in something. They may like listen to it in the car or something, but who want's to do that. The only people I know that buy soundtracks use them in some sort of film. I never seen anyone...ANYONE...listen to a soundtrack in the car or like on your iPod. There are hundreds of films on here that use film soundtracks (that didn't get permission), why am I the one who gets targeted?

Trust me, you're not the only one who has been targeted. It has come up before, and it will come up again.

Who knows why record stores sell soundtracks. Obviously some people do just listen to them. Just because you don't know any, doesn't mean they don't exist. I don't know anyone who listens to country music, but there seems to be a pretty big market for it, so there must be someone.

lol. good point about country music JW.

I've bought tons of soundtracks. Anything by Tim Burton, Goblin, Robert Rodriguez, Quentin Tarantino flicks, and lots of other soundtracks. I love instrumental music. As a musician and a director, listening to other people's soundtracks influence and inspire me to make something.

I ***** sometimes at all of the movies on this site that use the soundtrack from Requiem for a Dream. It's not just your movie.

Man, when you're sitting around arguing about this kind of stuff, it's time to step back and look at the broader scope of things.

Not so long ago they had book burnings and governments that would make artists renounce their work because it didn't fit in with the State's line. You think they care if someone used their music in some film after watching the original recordings and writings be burned and banned by their government.

i understand the right to protect what you've worked so hard to produce. But if you look through history, it's only in the past 60 years or so years that ANY artist was even considered to have any right to their own creations, much less make money to it.

Before then not only were artists poor and penniless, but almost anything they did was owned by someone else, or a completely public work. Let's have some perspective.

Sitting around arguing about using this and that is pretty childish, and i know i know, it's the law. but man, if you have the audacity to say no to someone that respects and loves your work so much they want to use it, you need to get your airy, pretentious head back down to earth.

I love original scores from films, I listen to them all the time (on my iPod, no less). Listening to Antonio Pinto's "Requiem" from Collateral or Thomas Newman's "Dead Already" from American Beauty is a terrific help with writer's block, I agree with paul on that. I've heard the argument that movie scores "have no soul" and "don't work without the movie", but James Newton Howard's "The Hand of Fate- Part 2" sure sounds like music to me. Films (usually) feature both sound and image, and if the film is done right either element can work on its own and only be emphasized by the addition of the other.
And paul- A movie that I co-directed that is on this site, "One Shot", features music from Requiem for a Dream. We didn't use it because we were trying to copy Requiem (Several of us, including myself, had never even seen the movie before. Great story about when I did see it, though, I'll talk about that later). We made the film and felt it worked, but heard someone playing the soundtrack in an adjacent dorm and realized that it fit perfectly. We just imported the song and didn't have to change the visuals at all. I'm not going to try and defend every a$$h0le who's ever used Clint Mansell's brilliant score, but keep in mind that reasons for using music in a movie are as diverse as movies themselves, lumping them all together isn't fair to the filmmakers. Sometimes they're jerks who attempt to imitate other, better films by using the same music. Sometimes it just works.
And about that great story:
Last August my girlfriend of 8 months at the time, who I hadn't seen for a month while she was at camp, made me watch Requiem for a Dream and directly afterwards broke up with me at 1:00 in the morning. After which I had to walk more than 120 blocks home from 110th street in New York City because I didn't have any money and no one else was home. I got home around 5:30 AM.
I love that story. I'd make a movie about it, but then I'd have to use music from Requiem for a Dream.

RFranco: well said, man.

Legality aside, using professional film scores in a student film is something I think the majority of student filmakers do at first. Trying to emulate the big budget feel of a real film in your garage. Eventually, when you get more serious about it you crave an individual and unique soundtrack and move onto original music. Changing gears, I listen to film soundrtacks all the time. The Life Aquatic, 8 1/2, and Eternal Sunshine soundtrack are in my car at this moment. (edit: posted in wrong forum) Noir I thought your last sentence was pretty funny.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: particleman,

You will not get into a lot of film festivals if you did not clear the rights with the record company. It's sad but true. It is in fact not authorized and thusly slightly illegal (more-so if you make a profit).

Yes, big movies use commercial songs but they pay a lot of money just to feature them. This is just how the business is.

The first film I ever had on this site, I got the rights for, in my new film I have no music. I kind of like not having music, most people dislike my movies due to this. Whatever.

You got to read up more on these things. Best of luck.

Noirboy101, I understand you weren't copying Requiem. I never said that you were. That score just grows really tiresome when it happens to be EVERYWHERE you turn. I wasn't making an attack on you. I liked One Shot, I thought it was a nice little piece, and the music worked well. I just think that Mansell's score is heavily over used, both by student film makers and hollywood alike. Your film is one of the exceptions where it meshes. Most people throw it into anything, and that's annoying. You get me?

"I never seen anyone...ANYONE...listen to a soundtrack in the car or like on your iPod."

I currently have several film soundtracks on my iPod. You must not watch films with good music if you think it doesn't stand on its own.

I target everyone who uses copyrighted music, not just you. It's not acceptable practice to take music from big-budget, commercial productions because you are too lazy to ask someone to score it for you or do it yourself. Furthermore, what makes you think music from another film will adequately suit your film? If you really cared about the creative process you'd make or commission some kind of original music.

It offends me when I see many of the projects on this site grasping for higher quality by stealing copyrighted music instead of working on their end of it. Do you see where I'm coming from? As the filmmaker, it's your responsibility to control and create what appears on screen and also work with the soundtrack. If you aren't happy with your projects, improve your composition, writing, editing, and find better actors. Don't "upgrade" to some immediately recognizable music from a Hollywood blockbuster, or anything copyrighted, unless you obtained permission.

So many projects on this site use music from Road to Perdition, Saving Private Ryan, Requiem for a Dream, or Gladiator that I usually stop watching as soon as I recognize the recycled cue and fire off a quick review advising the director to use original music next time.

I understand completely Evan. But you also have to understand that by that movie it cleary says, "Vista Heights MIDDLE SCHOOL". Which means I am only13 and I am only starting out and I don't have any money. I would of got a composer, that would of been the best thing ever. But obviously I'm broke. My friends are 13 as well, and they are just starting out also, never acted before. I tried the best I can and I will try harder in the future, but you have to understand I-AM-ONLY-13 which means no one wants to bother with me and my stupid movies.

So directors like Quentin Tarantino and Wes Anderson are lazy and unoriginal since their soundtracks mostly consist of using songs that they like that were written a long time before the movie?

I use music from people all the time simply because I think music that is forced into a movie sound terrible most of the time. Songs written for movies(like when Madonna and Garbage wrote James Bond themes) or a lot of film scores sound terrible because they're timed to the edited piece.

I think music comes from something very personal and very basically human, and it's not something you can force out, especially to fit into a section of a movie.

I'd rather hear the song first and then find the scenes to put with the music, it flows better that way. If none of the songs sound right, then no music goes along with it. But if Bjork writes this beautifully painful song, or Joy Division writes this great beat and these lyrics that describe this girl and relationships perfectly, that's exactly what I'm putting, because really there is only ONE Bjork and only ONE Joy Division.

Well Ryan, despite the small argument that's been started, you've managed to keep your cool, remain mature and not call anyone names or anything. You've tough skin and you can keep your cool at only 13, I know people who are well into their 20s who can't manage that. They also make Star Wars Fan Films. Anyways, I respect you for that.

Whether you're on PC or mac, you've got options to compose music. You can also download and use most of the music at www.archive.org, usually as long as you give credit to the original author.

I might be able to help you out with some tunes as well. PM me.

"Nobody listens to soundtracks"

I know lots of poeple that do.

The "Requiem for a Dream" soundtrack is amazing. And not everybody likes Rock and Rap. I know lots of older people that love good music w/ no lyrics and soundtracks lots of times have that. And if they don't, it's stuff like "Garden State" or "Resident Evil" (rock) and they sell like crazy. One guy I know only listens to soundtracks with music and no lyrics and The "Amelie" soundtrack is another amazing one I enjoy. So iI definately disagree soundtrack's are only for using for your own independent movies and nobody lsitens to them otherwise.

However, If you are editing and need music to edit to for inspiration, lots of times a soundtrack helps. That's what we did for "Isolation". We edited to this one song from "Crazy Beaitiful" and looped it over and over. It was a mellow guitar type thing. Then we dicided to change the pace a little bit and edited to the "Requiem for a Dream" soundtrack. The we finally got our own done, but we couldn;t do our own till the movie was done and it took the director music to get a steady pace.

So if you edit to a good soundtrack that works and then do your own that's fine. (although even in that case you can get in trouble, but only if you're James Cameron). When they were editing Titanic they used Enya's music. She found out and was pissed. They wanted to use it for the actual movie but not now. Not after using it w/o her permission. So they got Celine Dion to do it). But I doubt you'll ever have that problem and if you have the problem of directing a $200 movie someday, well, got some money you can spare>

Anyways, it is still great to hear that a 13 year old already is getting his work on the internet for poeple to see. Great Work. That is amazing for your age and keep your good attitude too. I know your still learning. And one thing you'll learn is that you can never stop learning in this business.

best of Luck Ryan