Okay, I know that theres tons of information on cameras in these forums. And I know im probably going to get flamed on more levels than one for what im going to ask. However, i want to explain my situation, and hopefully get some better input as to what i should look into for my budget and for what i'm trying to do. here goes:

A guy i know came to me with a really good idea for a film. A feature. I wrote the script and he's willing to back me for 10-20 large.

The area that i live in is very conducive to the type of movie im going to make. I live in a rural area, and have come into contact with a handful of some really cool local actors that are willing to work for experience.

I have a decent amount of audio and lighting equipment.

My movie contains no costly special effects or arial shots or anything that is too elaborate..just a fairly original idea (i hope) and some really cool actors.

So basically, im going to get creative to try to cut costs as much as possible, but what i am very concerned with, of course, is making a pretty film. I'm technically challenged as of now, but i consider myself to be a fast learner, and hopefully capable.

I want a really good camera, that won't completely drain my budget. I'm willing to do film, HD...whatever. I'm going to have to learn it from scratch anyways. I just want to have a nice looking movie. I'm really pumped about my story, and the opportunity to have this guy back me with his doe. Any input will be greatly appriciated.

P.S. I know, I probably sound like an idiot, talking about trying to make a feature, and not even knowing what type of camera to buy. But, imo, technical is the last thing to worry about. The story comes first.
Thanks.

Hey,

Although I have fairly limited knowledge in the area of Film i think you would be better off going with HD becasue film, expesially 16 or 35mm require a lot of knowhow and experience to pull off effectivly and nicely. How ever with digital it is easy to learn and gives quicker results. Plus if you want to cut costs digital is a lot cheaper then film.
For instance, im just starting to get into super 8mm and from what I gather, about 40 minutes of film costs upwards of 500.00cdn!
i have no idea how much !6 or 35mm would cost but i think it would be a lot more.

hope i could help...

If you have $10,000 - $20,000 as a budget that's pretty small for a feature film, but there have been those that have pulled it off i.e. the film "Primer" which won the Best Picture award at the 2004 Sundance Film Festival. The film was made for $7,000 but that didn't come without a huge amount of problems. They shot the film at a 1-1 ratio which means they only used one take and one take only and then moved on. I say if you're inexperienced at the technical side of filming you're going to need to get an experienced Director of Photography to pull off the look you want. Try posting on www.craigslist.org there is a TV / Film / Video link on the site where you do it.

You can also post on that site for positions on your film and there are a lot of people that would be willing to work for experience. But really you'll need to pay the DP for sure. Really though check out the "Primer" web site http://primermovie.com/ there is a bit of info on how they made the film. HD really can be expensive too, you might think of shooting your film on Super 16mm, I'd definitely look into both. Research them on the internet. Anyway I was more curious than I was helpful I think, sorry. Have a great day and good luck!


Nathan Fackrell

www.eclipsefilmfest.com

You should try to stay away from actual film on this movie. First of all, it's difficult to learn and hard to work with. And film reel costs thousands and thousands of dollars. You're way better off going with HD or DV. It's so much easier to work with and SO much faster. On the Once Upon A Time In Mexico DVD, Robert Rodriguez does a whole lecture on how DV is the way to go.

So, check out some HD and DV cameras. There's a post somewhere on this board about what HD cameras Michael Mann used on Collateral. You may want to check those out. There's the Canon XL2 that's out now. Maybe check into that too.

And like someone has already said, try to get a decent DOP that will know what he's doing.

quote:

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On the Once Upon A Time In Mexico DVD, Robert Rodriguez does a whole lecture on how DV is the way to go.

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God, I loved that. Rodriguez sold me on DV. I've watched it a million times and I never get tired of him saying it.

Anyways, you may want to consider 2 Panasonic AG-DVX100A or 2 Canon XL2.

HIRE HIRE HIRE HIRE HIRE HIRE.

you can get better gear by hiring, which is only going to improve your film.

that is all i suggest.

You can probably find someone with a camera and experience to hire that will shoot it and make it pretty for you that won't be that expensive. No matter how fast of a learner you are, someone that has been shooting video or film for 10 years is going to know a lot more things than you do.

HD is much more complicated than film, it's hard and it's take quite a few extra people on the camera crew to get it to work. HD isn't like shotting miniDV at all, the only similiarities is that it records '1' and '0'.

Robert Rodriguez's "lecture" on HD was a bit facetious, and he has a tendency to gloss over details since he gets so excited over things. When he mentions "nostalgia" as the only reason film would be a better choice, it's being pretty dishonest. While digital has the potential to surpass film in color reproduction and contrast, it's not there yet, and even companies such as Texas Instruments, Sony, and Panasonic will admit to that much.

His stance that allowing the camera to roll between takes leads to better performances is up in the air, since Rodriguez's movies have never been known for their great acting, and there hasn't been much improvement in the quality of the acting. His strengths are in the shot selection and the movement within the scene and between cuts. Plus having that much more footage through go through must just be a pain in the *** for the editors.

You should always be careful of lectures that don't allow both sides to state their case.

Awesome, thanks all for the good input. How good of quality can you get from DV? The XL2 looks pretty cool...

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Raj,

If someone is giving you 20 grand to make a film you better know how to make a film, and it sounds like you may not. They are going to be real pissed off when you come back with a bad film. As others have said you should probably hire. You would be surprized at what you can get when you are working on a low bug film. Some big names will sometimes help out if they have the free time. Have you ever directed a movie? Have you ever worked on a feature film? From your post this sounds way over your head. How many pages is the script? Why is this person giving you 20 grand? I dont mean to be a dick, but while a 'real' movie will spend more than 20gs on craft services, its still a lot of money to a person.

With all of that said you onl need one camera. If I were you I'd get a Panny DVX 100 and spend a week learning that. Then I'd build a PVC track dolly, buy a GlideCam , a good lighting kit a decent shot gun mic and a bounce board (Or a big piece of carboard with tin foil). Thats probably about $7,000 of your budget. Use the rest to hire a DP, someone on sound (Who KNOWS HOW TO DO SOUND! Bad sound = bad movie) two "general" people (Hopefully some friends who will work for food) that can setup lights, move the dolly around , etc. That leaves you with a little over 10k to use to buy costums, props, etc. Also, its in your best interest to pay NO ONE. If you pay one actor and not the rest, the others will be pissed.

Edit: Its in your best interest to not pay any of the actors. If you pay one you have to pay them all. If you can, id pay the DP and the sound tech if you must (Although you might be able to get them for free)

Where are you shooting this?

First off, Double, thanks alot for the info man, very helpful. You weren't bein a dick, it's my fault for not fully explaining myself.
By what information I gave, you were only being honest.

My girlfriends uncle, who I know pretty well, came to me (fully knowing that I have no real experience, but knowing that I want to make movies) and told me he wanted to make a movie about some stuff that was goin on around my town. I just said "I got backed" because it sounds much cooler than "my girlfriends uncle wants to make a movie" :P

Anyways, in no way am I misleading anyone, if I'm in over my head, we both are. heh..He came up with the money by gambling, so he's not taking any real losses.

the script is 97 pages, but it still needs a bit of work. And no, I don't plan to start shooting until the script is solid.

Hopefully that sounds a little better.

Anyhow, thanks again for the advice and the input on equipment. Again, very helpful

I'm shooting the majority of the movie in Deming, NM

Raj - that does sound a lot better. None the less, you could make a good movie for 20 grand. I think its actually a nice amount for a low budget film. Your best bet for getting locations is to act like a student film maker with no budget. That way no one expects anything. Oh, since you have the money, id get a crane off ebay. They go on your tripod and will give you an even higher production value. Throw that pup on the PVC dolly i was talking about and you can do damn near anything. Do spend a few hundred bucks on a good tripod with a fluid head.

What do you plan on doin with this film? What are your goals? If you werent on the other side of the country i'd offer to help you out .

If you want help with your script feel free to send it over and Ill go over it and offer sugestions. I wish you the best of luck. This is a great opportunity. But if you have never shot a short before you may want to push this aside for a while. As the director you are the leader and a feature length will be WAY over your head if you've never directed before.

What i would do is buy the eqiupment (DVX 100a, light kit, shot gun mic/boom, bounce board,trip pod, dolly, crane) And make two 10 minute shorts. Make the first one good and the second one great. Each will take you a month or so depending on how mcuh time you have. (I am assuming you know how to edit and have a NLE at your disposal). After doing two shorts you will have a much better idea on how to do things and youll be pretty comfortable with all your equipment. If you try and just run in there with no experience yuo are going fail.

Although maybe you've done a bunch of shorts before. In that case just spend a week doing test shots with all your new toys and have fun!

Your girlfriend's uncle is going to give you $20,000 to make your first feature film? Don't break up with her until you finish post, then...

Seriously, get contracts, get everything in writing, and try to get in touch with some local indie groups to find people who are more experienced with the technical aspect. If this is your first time directing anything, there's no way in hell you should start off with a $20,000 feature. Make a couple of shorts and get the crap out of your system. I would say at least a dozen. If you go straight into features you'll have no idea how long it takes to film things, and what needs to be done, as well as working with a crew, so the project will collapse within a day or two.

read the book digital filmmaking 101, it's all about making ultra low budget features.